I said NO he doesn't get it back, it's exiled as she controlled it and now its gone. Plus, even when we don't have an Endless Whispers, playing a bunch of removal and wraths helps keep us alive while we are looking to set up our combo finish.Â, At first glance, it might look like Thoughtseize, Inquisition of Kozilek, and Ratchet Bomb don't really fit the theme of the deck, since they don't really synergize with Endless Whispers (although Ratchet Bomb can kill creatures in a pinch), but they are actually super important to the combo. Endless Whispers is essentially a control-changing effect. When Phage the Untouchable enters the battlefield, if you didn't cast it from your hand, you lose the game. Heading into the building process, apart from winning (and hopefully doing something cool) with Phage the Untouchable, I also wanted to make sure that today's deck felt different from the Endless Whispers deck from back in 2016. While the Endless Whispers / Phage the Untouchable combo can beat anything, it's pretty slow, requiring us to get all the way up to seven mana, and then likely wait another turn to kill the Phage the Untouchable, which means it's pretty unlikely we can race most combo decks. The examples right in how that process works show a Bribery TappedOut.js Blog Widget. gives you control when the ability resolves) and how in those cases, since there's no duration to end, the card will end up getting exiled. This time, with Endless Whispers teaming up with Phage the Untouchable. Viscerid Drone! Not only can it work like a Donate to give an opponent a creature in conjunction with a removal spell or sacrifice outlet, but since the effect is symmetrical and impacts all creatures, it can also be used as part of a build-your-own Control Magic combo. Endless Whispers, however, is the card that achieves the dream. The whole reason the third clause is even there is for cases like that. It can't be regenerated. My opponent does something like block with [Insert 4/4 or bigger] that trades kill for kill. Let's see! and Endless Whispers Then up came another argument over the EXACT same thing when my fiance stole someone's Eldrazi Monument © 1995-2021 Wizards. If you enjoy the Against the Odds series and the other video content here on MTGGoldfish, make sure to subscribe to the MTGGoldfish YouTube Channel. Whenever Phage deals combat damage to a creature, destroy that creature. Control effects which last "until end of turn" or "until X leaves the battlefield" or "As long as Y remains tapped" etc have durations, and those effects will all be ended by the player leaving the game. Here's to helping n00bs! There was a control-changing effect giving the player control of Eldrazi Monument Endless Whispers combos with Phage the Untouchable 's ETB death trigger. Then, if that player controlled any objects on the stack not represented by cards, those objects cease to exist. My personal information may be used for the purposes defined in the privacy policy. From the examples of objects and control in 800.4a: Example: Alex casts Bribery, which reads, "Search target opponent's library for a creature card and put that card onto the battlefield under your control. If the player who left the game had priority at the time he or she left, priority passes to the next player in turn order who's still in the game. 4 Phage the Untouchable. Building FNM-worthy decks without breaking the bank. Casting Phage the Untouchable from the command zone would be a sorcery-speed "Summon Game Loss" spell. My friend is telling me that if I play Endless Whispers and then murder Phage The Untouchable I would be the one to lose when it enters under their control. Platinum Angel My understanding is that Phage, having entered the battlefield already under your opponent's control, will wind up exiled when that player dies because there are no standing control effects to end (the endless whispers effect is a one and done sort of thing which permanently grants control), so command zone it is. For one thing, we only have one creature in our deck, and if our opponent steals it, they'll die, but for another thing, a lot of decks play removal that isn't all that good at triggering Endless Whispers like Path to Exile.Â, $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00, Probably the ultimate blow-outs are Damnation and Mutilate, which turn into permanent Insurrections when we have an Endless Whispers on the battlefield, stealing all of our opponent's creatures at once. Then turn two by playing the mountain, throw down a dark ritual to play Endless Whispers and also drawing a terminate. See our privacy policy. Then, one of two things can happen. This means our opponent goes into permanent chump-block mode, because if they actually kill the Phage the Untouchable by blocking or with a removal spell (discounting things like Path to Exile that exile), it will return from our graveyard under their control at the beginning of the next end step, thanks to Endless Whispers, and they'll lose the game. as the commander in my deck. . Since there's no currently in force effect changing the controller of Phage, she sticks around until the time all the losing player's permanants are exiled, and then you can put it into the Command Zone. Spell 34 4 Brainstorm 2 Endless Whispers 4 Force of Will 4 Lotus Petal 4 Omniscience 4 Ponder 4 Preordain 4 Show and Tell 4 Spell Pierce. Four-player Commander battles featuring a new theme every week. The good and bad matchups for Endless Whispers are pretty straightforward. Keep replaying Sidisi, tutoring for such niceties as Cabal Coffers, Endless Whispers, Bronze Bombshell and Phage the Untouchable. Plus, we just don't have very many cards that interact with these strategiesâwe're pretty much counting on our discard to keep us aliveâand while discard is helpful, it's not usually enough unless it's backed up by a fast clock, which our deck lacks. Finally, the fact that we have 20 creature-removal spells in the main deck is a double-edged sword. € 0,07. 3 Phage the Untouchable; Spells 33. Don't forget to come back next week when we get to start exploring Eldritch Moon! MTGGoldfish, Inc. is not affiliated with Wizards of the Coast LLC. . In Shai_Hulud's words, “The idea is to get an Endless Whispers in play then play Sky Swallower and float enough mana to cast Innocent Blood , Chainer's Edict , or Cabal Therapy . , then later lost the game with all other players still alive. Combo Endless Whispers +Phage the Untouchable . She is exiled and then I use the replacement effect to place her in the command zone instead. That said, the way the games broke down were incredibly odd. Alex puts Serra Angel onto the battlefield from Bianca's library. But [insert squabbling over rules here] happened and I finally said screw it and blew up the entire field so it didn't matter. It's roughly as fun AND reliable as playing your state lottery. Then, in games two and three, not only was our opponent expecting Endless Whispers and Phage the Untouchable, but they also brought in a ton of sideboard hate, in the form of enchantment removal or graveyard disruption, which made winning much, much more difficult post-sideboarding.Â, It's also worth nothing that we got a little lucky in matchups, running into mostly creature decks and avoiding the noninteractive combo decks that would have been horrible matchups. Endless Whispers Lotus Bloom Sol Ring Extraplanar Lens Solemn Simulacrum Search for the perfect addition to your deck. Of course we would use the replacement effect, but that isn't the real question here, it is all about what zone she is would have been placed into previous to that effect happening. Also works with Leveler There's no effect currently going on to be ended by 800.4a. Anyway, that's all for today! First, we can start attacking our opponent with Phage the Untouchable, and if we ever get in combat damage, our opponent loses the game on the spot. You don't have the option of letting her hit a graveyard to trigger Endless Whispers, because at no point in that process does Phage die. It can't be regenerated. situation when my fiance lost the game after taking another players artifact, the artifact is exiled. or whatever other effect put it onto the battlefield under that player's control. If Bianca leaves the game, Serra Angel also leaves the game. That's why it's able to work at all (instead of doing nothing when you activate it). Legallity. I have Manifest Phage. Second, we can simply kill our own Phage the Untouchable with one of our endless removal spells to get the "combo kill" with Endless Whispers. To make sure we have our Endless Whispers and / or Phage the Untouchable when we need them, we also have Dark Petition to search up either half of our combo.Â, $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00 $ 0.00, The other thing that Endless Whispers can do is turn any removal spell into a Control Magic that also triggers enters-the-battlefield abilities. So, when we aren't killing our opponent with the Phage the Untouchable combo, our goal is to get an Endless Whispers on the battlefield and use our ample removal (we have a massive 20 cards in our main deck that can kill one or more creatures) to steal our opponent's stuff and turn it against them.Â, The issue with this plan is that Endless Whispers is symmetrical, which means our opponent can also steal our creatures by killing them (or steal back their creatures), but our deck is built so that in most matchups, we should be able to take advantage of Endless Whispers far more consistently than our opponent. She was able to resolve from the command zone due to my So in short: Endless Whispers doesn't work with tokens. In our game ones, we managed to catch a lot of opponents by surprise with the Endless Whispers / Phage the Untouchable combo kill. A few weeks ago, when I previewed Endless Whispers, I noted that the new enchantment was the easiest way yet to pull off the nigh-impossible victory of forcing your opponent to put Phage the Untouchable directly into play. Can some new Kaldheim cards make GB Elves into a real deck in Pioneer now that some of the most broken cards have been banned from the format? If you are a resident of California, you have the right under the CCPA to opt out of the sale of personal information to third parties. Whenever Phage deals combat damage to a player, that player loses the game. 's ability creates a control-changing effect. Secondary Game Plan: Hug the underdog by giving them your general via Endless Whispers Phage/Karona 2 years ago Lich's Mastery also protects you from the ETB effect. So we're all on the same page as far as I can tell. My friends and I started thinking of ideas with Phage, the Untouchable and I just came up with Harmless Offering and I was wondering if this would work: Phage's first ability is "When Phage the Untouchable enters the battlefield, if you didn't cast it from your hand, you lose the game." Whenever Phage deals combat damage to a player, that player loses the game. Help | Normally on the Against the Odds polls, the option that receives the most votes gets made into the video, and the next two options remain on the next poll. Terms of Use | Bribery and Whispers aren't control-changing effects. The basic idea is that we'll get an Endless Whispers on the battlefield, and then cast a Phage the Untouchable. Whenever Phage deals combat damage to a creature, destroy that creature. After Memnarch's ability resolves, you have control of the artifact because the ability's effect is now in place. An old trick to get Phage the Untouchable to come into play under an opponent's control, it works just fine with Sky Swallower as well. We've updated our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy. You don't have the option of letting her hit a graveyard to trigger Endless Whispers, because at no point in that process does Phage die. As usual, Against the Odds finds a unique way to approach Modern—and a unique way to both win and lose. Then, when the poll returns next week, we'll have an all Eldritch Moon poll, so over the next few weeks, we'll get to cover all of the awesome new cards from the set! , then lost Memnarch As Affe points out, she could be countered when you play her, which would put her in your graveyard (or library, depending on the counter spell used). Because Phage is your commander, you can replace -any- Exile event with moving the Commander to your Command Zone, so when that player dies, and Phage gets exiled, you could move her back to the Command Zone. Because Phage is your commander, you can replace -any- Exile event with moving the Commander to your Command Zone, so when that player dies, and Phage gets exiled, you could move her back to the Command Zone. It happens as soon as the player leaves the game. This site is unaffiliated. Endless Whispers Highlighting the Pauper format where only Commons are allowed. We want to play against creature-based decks like Jund, Zoo, Merfolk, and Eldrazi, where we should be able to one-for-one them with our removal while we are waiting to get an Endless Whispers online, and after we have an Endless Whispers, all of our removal spells turn into two-for-ones because we get to steal our opponent's creatures.  On the other hand, we really, really struggle against decks like Ad Nauseam, Storm, Tron, and some builds of Scapeshift that don't really need to play creatures to win the game. Since she does return to play under my opponents control, barring anything stopping her first triggered ability, and the opponent loses the game, does she return to play under my control since she was last in play, or to the command zone, or to my graveyard? Articles and comments are user-submitted and do not represent official endorsements of this site. I move to attack step and declare attack of just The gatest Against the Odds episode of all time! While Victim of Night, Dismember, and Damnation are amazing when we are playing against creature-based decks, they are dead cards against many combo decks.Â, All in all, we won 6 of 15 games for a reasonable 40% game win percentage, but only 1 of 5 matches (20% match win percentage). Our deck is looking to take advantage of both aspects of the card! is not the same as Bribery The change of control happened as the resolution of an ability, but has no duration. Spell 32 3 Damnation 2 Dark Petition 3 Demonic Pact 2 Dismember 3 Endless Whispers 4 Fatal Push 3 Harmless Offering 4 Inquisition of Kozilek 1 Kolaghan's Command 4 Lightning Bolt 1 … One more thing before we get to the videos. . Land 21 3 Ancient Tomb 2 City of Traitors 2 Flooded Strand 3 Island 1 Misty Rainforest 4 Polluted Delta 2 Scalding Tarn 4 Underground Sea. The most fun thing to do with Phage is imprint her on a Summoner's Egg or Clone Shell.Give the card to your opponent somehow (Bazaar Trader, Legerdemain-- whatever).Then simply kill the Shell / Egg. Then use Phage the Untouchable with either [ [Endless Whispers]] and a sac outlet to oneshot someone or [ [Fractured Identity]] to kill the entire table. Wizards of the Coast, Magic: The Gathering, and their logos are trademarks of Wizards of the Coast LLC. If it weren't then the artifact would remain under the control of its current controller, because it would remain subject to either the rule about resolving artifact spells (301.2. It's already on the battlefield, so it's not entering again. That player puts this creature card from that graveyard into play under his or her control at end of turn." If the player who left the game had priority at the time he or she left, priority passes to the next player in turn order who's still in the game. Planeswalker 3 3 Liliana of the Veil. Endless Whispers is a really unique card. Join Crim (TheAsianAvenger), Seth (SaffronOlive) and Richard (BlackTuna) as they discuss the weekly news and answer user submitted questions. You may use any printing of a card that has an appearance in a standard legal set. You've got four steps to clear all their stuff out of the game: 1/ Everything they Own leaves2/ Any effects giving them control of a thing they don't own, end3/ Anything still on the stack ceases to exist4/ Anything still under their control is exiled, Why is step 4 even there then? Damage resolves and she dies, and instead of choosing to put her in the command zone, I let her truly die and enter the graveyard. When a player leaves the game, all control-changing effects they control end, which would return control of Phage the Untouchable to its owner. Magic the Gathering, FNM is TM and copyright Wizards of the Coast, Inc, a subsidiary of Hasbro, Inc. All rights reserved. kpres on Crouching Kadena, Hidden Phage 4 days ago. No poll this week. High Market! Marjhan! We'll talk more about Endless Whispers in a minute, but first a quick reminder. The fact that the effect doesn't have a specified duration doesn't matter. Whenever Phage deals combat damage to a player, that player loses the game. 800.4a When a player leaves the game, all objects (see rule 109) owned by that player leave the game, any effects which give that player control of any objects or players end, and all spells and abilities controlled by that player on the stack cease to exist. But while I was playing another game not involving Phage at all, the Memnarch Welcome to Commander Week, 2015! I feel like I may have posted this elsewhere before and I'm sorry if I did, but I failed to find the original posting so... Yeah. Building janky brews based on your votes. Win at spot. Phage the Untouchable is the only creature in our deck, but it's also the best creature in all of Magic when played alongside Endless Whispers. Please take a moment to review them and accept to continue. Which would be the same resolution that Goofball explained, and is exactly what my point it. When Phage the Untouchable enters the battlefield, if you didn't cast it from your hand, you lose the game. An ability resolved, which changed the controller. At MTGGoldfish, we value your privacy. She returns to battlefield under opponent's control and triggers. After that, you can pretty much do anything you want. 4 Phage the Untouchable 4 Endless Whispers 4 Cabal Therapy 4 Innocent Blood 4 Chainer's Edict 4 Diabolic Tutor 4 Mutilate 2 Insidious Dreams 2 Talisman of Indulgance 2 Talisman of Dominance 22 Swamp 4 Cabal Coffers Against the Odds: Endless Whispers | MTGGoldfish | SaffronOlive; What kind of deck wins all of its Game 1s and none of its Game 2s? Then, … 800.4a When a player leaves the game, all objects (see rule 109) owned by that player leave the game and any effects which give that player control of any objects or players end. We have a large selection of Magic Singles. 2 Disfigure; 2 Duress; 1 Elixir of Immortality; 2 Bile Blight; 1 Distress; 3 Grasp of Darkness; 3 Sign in Blood; 4 Victim of Night; 2 Hero's Downfall; 3 Underworld Connections; 4 Endless Whispers; 2 Mastermind's Acquisition; 2 Mutilate; 1 Consume the Meek 1 Ob Nixilis, the Hate-Twisted; Lands 24. Since the effect which Serra Angel into play under Alex's control started and ended with the resolution of that spell, when Alex leaves the game, the Angel does not go back to Bianca, but is instead exiled. Discord Server | 1 Bronze Bombshell 1 Phage the Untouchable. It happens as soon as the player leaves the game. Weekly drafts featuring a variety of formats new and old. Card Name: Endless Whispers Cost: 2BB Color: Black Card Type: Enchantment Card Text: Each creature has "When this creature is put into a graveyard from play, choose target opponent. Whenever Phage deals combat damage to a creature, destroy that creature. Let Phage die with endless whispers in play. incident described above, it is put in the same situation as Phage. So the deck evolved, the chaos toned down, into a playable EDH deck. (Making it an awesome addition to a token deck, since your opponents can't steal your creatures). Early Strixhaven: School of Mages including the new Mystical Archive! All rights reserved. Memnarch DMCA requests | Seth introduces this week's Against the Odds deck, build around Endless Whispers in Modern! This causes your opponent to lose when it comes into play from the graveyard. As such, we're letting you know that we've updated our Privacy Policy to reflect the new rule set forth by the European Union's General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR). Stranger still, we had a 100% game win percentage for game ones, but then we won 0% of game twos and only 20% of game threes. Either way if another player controls a permanent they do not own, and it does not have a time limit on the control, it becomes exiled. So what is step 4 FOR if not "Things they control, don't own, but which aren't being controlled by an ability of ongoing duration". 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